1/5/2020 Binding Pin Heights
Alpine skiers can be surprised to learn that tech bindings essentially suspend your boot in the air above your ski. Your weight is not resting on the ski at all, but rather is supported by metal pins that insert into reinforced holes found on Dynafit compatible ski boots. It can be important to consider just how far off the deck your toes and heels are floating, since this can affect how your weight is balanced over your skis.
The height of the pins that hold your boots is not typically published by binding manufacturers. However, this can be good information to know if you are trying to determine the angle of ramp between your ski and ski boot. As such, we took to measuring them. See below for a list of pin heights in millimeters for common tech bindings, accurate to within one millimeter:
| Binding | Toe Height | Heel Height | Delta |
| ATK Revolution | 29 | 29 | 0 |
| ATK Revolution Brake | 29 | 28 | -1 |
| ATK SL World Cup | 30 | 29.5 | -0.5 |
| ATK Trofeo | 30 | 30 | 0 |
| ATK Trofeo Brake | 30 | 28 | -2 |
| ATK Kuluar | 30 | 41.5 | +11.5 |
| ATK Haute Route | 30 | 36.5 | +6.5 |
| ATK Haute Route Plus (2024+) | 33.5 | 36.5 | +3 |
| ATK Haute Route Plus (2023) | 30 | 36.5 | +6.5 |
| ATK Candy | 33.5 | 41.5 | +8 |
| ATK Crest (2024+) | 33.5 | 45 | +11.5 |
| ATK Crest (2023-) | 30 | 41 | +11 |
| ATK V-Crest | 33.5 | 41.5 | +8 |
| ATK RT 8/10 Evo | 30 | 44.5 | +14.5 |
| ATK RT 11 Evo | 34.5 | 44.5 | +10 |
| ATK C-Raider | 33.5 | 43.5 | +10 |
| ATK Raider (2020+) | 31.5 | 43 | +11.5 |
| ATK Raider SL | 33.5 | 45 | +11.5 |
| ATK Raider Evo | 33.5 | 44.5 | +11 |
| ATK Freeraider Evo | 37.5 | 44.5 | +7 |
| ATK Freeraider | 31.5 | 43 | +11.5 |
| Atomic Backland | 30.5 | 39 | +8.5 |
| Atomic Summit | 33.5 | 41 | +7.5 |
| BD Helio 110 | 30 | 29.5 | -0.5 |
| BD Helio 145 | 30 | 30.5 | +0.5 |
| BD Helio 180 | 30 | 36.5 | +6.5 |
| BD Helio 200 LT | 30 | 31.5 | +1.5 |
| BD Helio 200 | 30 | 36.5 | +6.5 |
| DPS L10 | 30 | 36.5 | +6.5 |
| DPS R10 | 35 | 43 | +8 |
| DPS H10 | 34 | 44.5 | +10.5 |
| DPS R14 | 35.5 | 43.5 | +8 |
| Dynafit Blacklight | 30.5 | 39.5 | +9 |
| Dynafit DNA / Mezzalama | 30 | 33.5 | +3.5 |
| Dynafit Low Tech Race | 28.5 | 28.5 | 0 |
| Dynafit LTR 105 | 30 | 30.5 | +0.5 |
| Dynafit Radical ST/FT | 35.5 | 50.5 | +15 |
| Dynafit Radical ST Alu | 37 | 53 | +16 |
| Dynafit Radical 2.0 | 38 | 51 | +13 |
| Dynafit Ridge | 37.5 | 44.5 | +7 |
| Dynafit Rotation 7 | 38 | 50.5 | +12.5 |
| Dynafit Rotation 10/12 | 38 | 51 | +13 |
| Dynafit Speed/Speedfit | 31 | 38.5 | +7.5 |
| Dynafit Seven Summits+ | 33.5 | 45.5 | +12 |
| Dynafit Speed Turn | 28.5 | 44 | +15.5 |
| Dynafit Speed Turn 2.0 | 30.5 | 45 | +14.5 |
| Dynafit Speed Radical | 30.5 | 45 | +14.5 |
| Dynafit Speed Superlite | 28.5 | 31 | +2.5 |
| Dynafit Superlite 150 | 30 | 36 | +6 |
| Dynafit Superlite 2.0/175 | 28.5 | 36 | +7.5 |
| Dynafit TLT Expedition | 28.5 | 31.5 | +3 |
| Dynafit Vertical ST | 33.5 | 49.5 | +16 |
| Fritschi Tecton | 41.5 | 51.5* | +10 |
| Fritschi Vipec | 41.5 | 51.5 | +10 |
| Fritschi Xenic | 32.5 | 47 | +14.5 |
| G3 Zed 9 / 12 | 39 | 43 | +4 |
| G3 ION | 40.5 | 51.5 | +11 |
| Grizzly GR98/Olympic | 27.5 | 26.5 | -1 |
| Hagan Boost | 34 | 43.5 | +9.5 |
| Hagan Core | 31.5 | 42.5 | +11 |
| Hagan Core Evo | 31.5 | 45 | +13.5 |
| Hagan Core Pro | 31.5 | 43.5 | +12 |
| Hagan Pure | 30 | 41 | +11 |
| Hagan Pin Up Evo | 30 | 44.5 | +14.5 |
| Hagan Ride | 31.5 | 36.5 | +5 |
| Hagan ZR / Ultra | 28 | 27.5 | -0.5 |
| Kreuzspitze EL | 29 | 35 | +6 |
| Kreuzspitze SCTT | 28.5 | 28 | -0.5 |
| Kreuzspitze RS | 29 | 28 | -1 |
| Kreuzspitze GT | 29 | 28.5 | -0.5 |
| Kreuzspitze GT 2.0 | 29.5 | 28.5 | -1 |
| La Sportiva RSR | 28 | 28.5 | +0.5 |
| Marker Alpinist | 34 | 36 | +2 |
| Marker Cruise | 34 | 48.5 | +14.5 |
| Marker Kingpin | 41 | 50.5* | +9.5 |
| Plum 99 | 30.5 | 28 | -2.5 |
| Plum 120 | 30.0 | 28.5 | -1.5 |
| Plum 135 / 145 | 27.5 | 29.5 | +2 |
| Plum 150 | 30.5 | 31.5 | +1 |
| Plum 165 | 27.5 | 31 | +3.5 |
| Plum 170 | 30.5 | 35 | +4.5 |
| Plum Oazo | 30.5 | 34.5 | +4 |
| Plum Pika | 30.5 | 39 | +8.5 |
| Plum WEPA | 31 | 42.5 | +11.5 |
| Plum Caribou / Karibou | 40 | 47.5 | +7.5 |
| Plum Guide | 29.5 | 47.5 | +18 |
| Plum Summit | 40 | 53.5 | +13.5 |
| Plum Yak | 39 | 47.5 | +8.5 |
| PG U77 | 28.5 | 32.5 | +4 |
| RC1 by PG | 24 | 30 | +6 |
| Salomon MTN | 30.5 | 39 | +8.5 |
| Salomon Summit | 33.5 | 41 | +7.5 |
| Ski Trab Gara Titan | 31 | 30 | -1 |
| Ski Trab Titan Brake | 31 | 31 | 0 |
| Ski Trab Titan Vario | 31 | 34 | +3 |
| Ski Trab Titan Adjustable | 35.5 | 42.5 | +7 |
| Ski Trab Titan Vario.2 | 35.5 | 44 | +8.5 |
| Ski Trab TR Race | 29.5 | 30 | +0.5 |
| Ski Trab TR Adjustable | 29 | 35 | +6 |
| Ski Trab TR-2 | 36 | 44* | +8 |
| Slatnar ST Touring | 29.5 | 40 | +10.5 |
| Tyrolia Almonte PT | 31.5 | 42 | +10.5 |
* Estimate of where heel pins would be.
The key number in the above table is pin height delta found in the last column. This number is an indication of how much higher your heel is than your toe. Higher deltas can shift your weight forward on the ski, which can be an unnatural feeling for some skiers. Somewhat counterintuitively, those skiers tend to end up in the “back seat” since their bodies naturally compensate with additional knee flex and backwards lean. While this is an OK position in certain situations, overall it causes poor control, unnecessary knee strain, and tired quads.
We would be remiss to not mention adjustment plates in this discussion. A tool for skiers with a quiver of boots, these plates are mounted under the toes (uncommon) and heels (common) of race bindings to provide some fore/aft adjustability. Since they are not zero inches thick, they will directly alter the pin heights of the bindings mounted on them. Here are the thicknesses of some popular adjustment plates, which are added to the binding pin heights:
| Adjustment Plate | Thickness |
| BD Helio | 5.5mm |
| Dynafit | 5mm |
| Hagan | 5mm |
| Kreuzspitze | 5.5mm |
| La Sportiva | 5mm |
| Plum | 6.5mm |
Now before you go calculating millimeters and adding shims, take a step back to realize there is no “correct” pin height delta. Alpine ski racers are used to aggressive postures and tend to prefer driving from the front seat. Casual powder hounds often like their weight back a bit as they surf through fluff with their tips high. Cross-country skiers tend to prefer an upright stance, and don’t want to be nudged in any direction. Lou Dawson established a baseline goal for himself to be roughly +12mm delta based on early Dynafit binding models.
We think you shouldn't worry too much about a few millimeters. However skier balance is additionally affected by other variables, such as the forward lean of boot cuffs, ramp built into the boot sole, and stock or aftermarket insoles. If all of these variables point in the same direction, it is easy for your balance to get out of whack. This can often be a relatively straightforward fix that involves mounting shims or toe plates under your bindings. If you’re looking for advice on your particular setup, please send us a message.
This article was originally published on 3/31/2014 and was last updated on 1/5/2020.Comments
5/18/2024
Is the ATK Haute Route heel height measured with or without the adjustment plate?
5/18/2024
Hi Josh, that includes the plate. See the BD Helio 200 LT for a fixed-mount version.
Reply to this comment:
1/22/2024
I posed this scenario to Jeff at Skimo recently-
Can I screw the Hagan Core 12 EVO toe piece with an ATK AL14 4mm toe spacer to an ATK R16A adjustment plate? He said yes, since the adjustment plate is secured to the ski in a wider bolt pattern, and the toe piece is secured to the adjustment plate with machine screws, it seems completely do-able.
Except it isn't. The machine screws that you would need to secure the toe piece (with spacer) to the adjustment plate do not exist. The machine screws that come with the R16A (5.7 x 9.5mm t-20 countersunk screws) are only long enough to secure the toe piece directly to the adjustment plate, and are 100% proprietary to ATK. Presently, they do not make the screws I would need (5.7 x 13.5mm t-20 countersunk). No one does. Don't bother checking a hardware store either, you'll be wasting your time.
Will there ever be a full featured touring binding that has zero binding delta? I get it- if you have a long foot, you don't have the delta problem. But for all us skiers with short BSL's and heel lifts in our boots, we do, and there is a HUGE vacuum in this market. Make a decent one and I'll be your first customer. You can even have my old bindings.
Can I screw the Hagan Core 12 EVO toe piece with an ATK AL14 4mm toe spacer to an ATK R16A adjustment plate? He said yes, since the adjustment plate is secured to the ski in a wider bolt pattern, and the toe piece is secured to the adjustment plate with machine screws, it seems completely do-able.
Except it isn't. The machine screws that you would need to secure the toe piece (with spacer) to the adjustment plate do not exist. The machine screws that come with the R16A (5.7 x 9.5mm t-20 countersunk screws) are only long enough to secure the toe piece directly to the adjustment plate, and are 100% proprietary to ATK. Presently, they do not make the screws I would need (5.7 x 13.5mm t-20 countersunk). No one does. Don't bother checking a hardware store either, you'll be wasting your time.
Will there ever be a full featured touring binding that has zero binding delta? I get it- if you have a long foot, you don't have the delta problem. But for all us skiers with short BSL's and heel lifts in our boots, we do, and there is a HUGE vacuum in this market. Make a decent one and I'll be your first customer. You can even have my old bindings.
1/22/2024
Hi Bill, in many shimming situations like this you have to modify screws by shortening the length and/or shrinking the head. Not exactly fun but we do it a lot.
1/22/2024
I appreciate the response! I had a feeling I would be grinding down a 14 or 16mm screw to the correct length, but it’s the head size that doesn’t match the common thread diameter. How can we get the ball rolling on such a project? Do you know which screw I’m talking about here?
Reply to this comment:
6/10/2023
Great content!
My measurements show that Vipecs are approx. 2mm higher in the heel than tectons. Check done on recent models.
My measurements show that Vipecs are approx. 2mm higher in the heel than tectons. Check done on recent models.
Reply to this comment:
4/22/2023
I recently bought Voile Objective BCs and added ATK Kuluar bindings but the balance feels off compared to the atomic backlands with marker alpinists I've been using. I feel like the bindings are too far forward on the voiles. Which is funny because the skis are almost identical measurements and the bindings got mounted in roughly the same place. Wondering if it's a ramp angle issue? Are there ATK toe plates or shims available?
4/22/2023
Hi Holly, yes it's possible for the additional ramp angle to cause that feeling, and in general, more forward mounts work better with flatter ramp. The Kuluar toe fits OK on the Classic shims.
Reply to this comment:
3/21/2023
Dynafit Blacklight binding ramp angle ? similar to TLT?
Reply to this comment:
10/3/2022
Any measurements on the Hagan Core Evo & BD Helio 350?
10/3/2022
Hi Fisher, we'll be sure to add the Core Evo when it arrives. We didn't stock the 350 franken-binding, but you can probably piece it together by matching the toes and heels.
2/4/2023
The BD Helio 350 is basically a Trofeo toe and Raider heel, correct? So 13 mm by this chart? Thanks.
2/4/2023
Hi Michael, that looks roughly correct.
Reply to this comment:
6/4/2022
Thanks to this website and in particular this thread, I figured out rather quickly why my touring skis didn't feel right. (Wobbly, like I didn't know how to ski all of a sudden.) Shims made a huge difference. Thanks to all who commented about this delta concept.
Reply to this comment:
12/14/2021
Thanks for all this detailed info. Skimoco rocks for going the extra mile on all this stuff! No wonder I feel off when I jump on my spring couloir L.Spva skis with ATK Crest versus my Trab race skis with ATK SL World Cup bindings. 11.5 difference is HUGE!
Reply to this comment:
12/14/2021
Hi, Might you be able to add the Grizzly Ski bindings to this delta list?
12/14/2021
Hi clark, thanks for the nudge. Added. They are pretty much flat as expected for a race binding.
Reply to this comment:
12/1/2021
Is the ramp angle of the C-Raider 12 the same as the standard Raiders? Or is the carbon toe a different height?
12/2/2021
Hi Chris, we just measured and added those to the list. The C-Raider is actually a slightly lower ramp due to a ~2mm taller toe.
Reply to this comment:
11/17/2021
Do you know what the pin heights are for the new 21/22 Dynafit Radical? I’m curious how it compares to the new 21/22 Dynafit Speed Radical. I’m having a “do I go with brakes?” dilemma, and also wondering if I should add toe shims. Thanks!
12/2/2021
Hi Josh, finally got some of the new Radical STs in. Looks like they are identical to the Speed Rads, so this may not be a criteria for you. The Speed Rads do take shims a little better since there isn't already a toe plate (in fact the Radical ST toe plate works great as a shim for the Speed Rads).
Reply to this comment:
2/7/2021
HI.
In the past I had all kind of Dynafits with 15 - 17 mm delta built-in.
After mounting a pair of Kingpins I immediately noticed positive effect of lower delta.
Right now I am ready to buy another set and I am still keen on old turn models ( at the moment I am on Turn 2.0 ).
Do you maybe know what is the delta of Radical turn 92?
I am not able to find this info.
Thanks,
Best regards,
Rok
In the past I had all kind of Dynafits with 15 - 17 mm delta built-in.
After mounting a pair of Kingpins I immediately noticed positive effect of lower delta.
Right now I am ready to buy another set and I am still keen on old turn models ( at the moment I am on Turn 2.0 ).
Do you maybe know what is the delta of Radical turn 92?
I am not able to find this info.
Thanks,
Best regards,
Rok
2/7/2021
Hi Rok, that binding isn't distributed in North America so we don't have a measurement. It's probably right around the same pin heights as the Radical ST.
Reply to this comment:
3/22/2020
Hi,
Thanks for all this information! I wish I would’ve studied this closer before buying speed radicals!
Anyway, what toe riser would you suggest to reduce ramp angle for them along with the screws please?
Thanks!
Thanks for all this information! I wish I would’ve studied this closer before buying speed radicals!
Anyway, what toe riser would you suggest to reduce ramp angle for them along with the screws please?
Thanks!
3/22/2020
Hi Molly, your best bet is to grab the Radical ST toe shims and related 19mm torx screws.
Reply to this comment:
2/16/2019
I'm assuming that the pin height for the heel pins is measured to the center of the pin (i.e. not the outside - top or Bottom - of the pin). Am I correct?
2/16/2019
Hi Yann, you are correct!
Reply to this comment:
11/19/2018
Shaka mahalo, bro, this is very helpful.
Reply to this comment:
10/28/2018
Hi, I’ve been using marker Dukes for years, and I recently mounted g3 ions on the same skis. It feels like I’m falling backwards. I’ve done what I feel is a good measurement and it looks to me like The boot heel is 1/2” higher with the Dukes compared to the ions. Does that sound reasonable or possible? Boots are Dalbello virus tour. I’m in the process of building some heel shims but wanted to check my sanity. Lots of talk about toe shims, but nothing on heels. Think this is the boots or bindings? Thoughts? Thanks so much for all you do on this site and at your shop.
Reply to this comment:
3/7/2018
Hi,
Great info on pin heights! Do you know the heel piece pin height of the dynafit superlite c-one binding (the one with +/-12mm adjustment and 4 bolt baseplate)? I can't find any reliable data on it anywhere!
Thanks,
James
Great info on pin heights! Do you know the heel piece pin height of the dynafit superlite c-one binding (the one with +/-12mm adjustment and 4 bolt baseplate)? I can't find any reliable data on it anywhere!
Thanks,
James
3/7/2018
Hi James, the heel pins are 37.5mm high.
Reply to this comment:
2/6/2018
A great addition to this chart would be a listing of the boot tech fitting pin height with the boot resting on a level surface. Just found out why the ramp angle inside the boot measures differently on the ski vs flat on the bench. The TLT 5 and 6 fitting pin height is approx. 4mm lower at the heel. The LaSportiva Spitfire 1.0 is 8mm lower at the heel and the Dynafit Zeus is 2mm higher at the heel. This does affect net ramp angle or the total of boot ramp and binding delta expressed as an angle (delta is often expressed as a linear measurement).
Counter intuitively, the steeper the forward ramp angle the more one has to compensate to get out of the backseat. This is assuming that the flex and fitting of the boot allows one to flex their ankle functionally while in the buckled boot. Ankle flex and ramp angle work together.
Counter intuitively, the steeper the forward ramp angle the more one has to compensate to get out of the backseat. This is assuming that the flex and fitting of the boot allows one to flex their ankle functionally while in the buckled boot. Ankle flex and ramp angle work together.
2/6/2018
Hi Herb, thanks for the input. We actually have a bunch of this data for boots but haven't published it. The problem is it doesn't account for internal ramp within the shell nor sole thickness variation. This means the resting height of the boot fittings isn't a precise indicator of how flat your foot actually is.
3/30/2018
So, of course, why not do boot board ramp angles. I am sure this is a lot of work but, the effect of ramp angle is extraordinarily underestimated. Ski boot makers cannot provide any real data backed by properly researched data for the ramp angles they use. With a major effort I recently proved to myself just how much ramp angle affects skiing. I went from about 9 degrees net ramp angle (5* in TLT5, + 3* Dynafit Speed Rad.) to a NRA of 2.5 degrees. The missing degree came from the difference in boot pin insert heights on my TLT5. When coupled with more room in the cuff to allow for proper functional ankle flex, the results were astounding at the least. Skiing was easier with waaaay better balance, terrain absorption and rarely if ever in the momentary backseat, something I have been fighting for over 55 years until now. Oh, yeah, I also had 3 and 4 degree cants under the bindings, a restrictive liner, and limited cuff flex/ankle flex. It all works together and cannot yield good results if done in half measures or done piecemeal. I know, I tried.
So, point is, the more data one has to work with the better the results with fewer hiccups and wasted time. Also the more we all step up to the fact that the ski industry needs to do a lot more research on the human/ski boot/binding interface the sooner they will get the message and step up as well. Publishing binding pin heights is a step in that direction. Information like this should be readily available from the manufacturers but, is not. Why is that?
I looked long and hard for good information on functional boot fitting and found The Skier's Manifesto website/blog by David Macphail is by far the best source for real information and answers. Web address is skimoves.me . David has been researching this subject for over 45 years and is still at it and still finding new things such as - ramp angle for some people may be much lower than previously determined. As low as 1.2 degrees in some cases and that it can vary individually but, is never more than 2.8 degrees.
Thanks,
Herb
So, point is, the more data one has to work with the better the results with fewer hiccups and wasted time. Also the more we all step up to the fact that the ski industry needs to do a lot more research on the human/ski boot/binding interface the sooner they will get the message and step up as well. Publishing binding pin heights is a step in that direction. Information like this should be readily available from the manufacturers but, is not. Why is that?
I looked long and hard for good information on functional boot fitting and found The Skier's Manifesto website/blog by David Macphail is by far the best source for real information and answers. Web address is skimoves.me . David has been researching this subject for over 45 years and is still at it and still finding new things such as - ramp angle for some people may be much lower than previously determined. As low as 1.2 degrees in some cases and that it can vary individually but, is never more than 2.8 degrees.
Thanks,
Herb
Reply to this comment:
1/8/2018
Your site has an amazing amount of info. As far as I can tell, it has everything except riser heights (in mm not degrees as some manufactures list). Dynafit website has no info either. Would love to see the heights listed!
1/8/2018
Hah, thanks Stan. We have an article just about ready to go with all the riser heights. Send us an e-mail and I can get you the data now.
11/6/2018
Hi Stan, the riser height info can be found here.
Reply to this comment:
11/27/2015
Nice website and parts selection. I want to add a shim under the toes of my Speed Radicals. Right now it feels like the original setup with the toe mounted flat on the deck is causing backseating. Think I want to rise it approx 3-4mm. What parts do I need to order including the proper screws. Is this mod a bolt on? screw length OK et et. Thanks, RON
11/27/2015
Thanks for the feedback Ron. The screws pass through the binding and shims and into the ski. For your target range, the easiest is the B&D 4.7mm classic shims and 23.5mm screws found here.
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1/16/2020
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